First Baptist Church and the Internet

[Uh Duh]

This story was reported by the Times-Union today. I have no opinion other than it must have been a tremendous leap of faith for a Judge to issue a subpoena.

Sept. 29: The Rev. John Blount files a report citing "an ongoing Internet incident that has possible criminal overtones." -TU

Say what?

This is the blog in question.

http://fbcjaxwatchdog.blogspot.com/

I must be missing something, like criminal overtones.

Read the full story in today's TU.

http://www.jacksonville.com/news/met...heriffs_office

"They may not have done anything wrong: "Undersheriff Frank Mackesy said Hinson’s role posed no conflict of interest because his duties include handling possible threats against the city’s large religious institutions."
What I am trying to figure out is why investigate at all? Call me a stupid pirate.

[Jimmy]

I'm glad you picked up on this UD! I've made my feelings about this situation known in the comments to the TU story. It's a scary thing...

[Jimmy]

Here's what I said over there:

This is a dangerous action taken by the Church and the JSO against free speech in Jacksonville. I've never been an "anonymous blogger," but many people who have come forward to share important insider information have done so under the cover of online pen names. Every person who posts to blogs, and even to the TU's site, should be wary of these tactics. A record is kept of your IP as you post comments (like this one). That record is tied to your internet service provider. If presented with legal process, AT&T, Comcast, and Clearwire will out you to the authorities. This is dangerous ground the JSO is walking with a potentially chilling effect on free and public discourse in our City. For this and so many reasons, I sign my name to anything I post online. Jimmy Midyette, Esq

I know that it would be easy to make this about the Church itself, but I think the issue goes beyond FBC. This was not so much a conflict of interest, but in fact a potential abuse of legal process and violation of the blogger's constitutional rights by an abuse of police power. This is about any powerful institution, be it a church or the City of Jacksonville, that decides to pervert the legal process in order to silence its critics. Dangerous ground...

I'm not out soliciting clients on the internet, suze. He needs to call the ACLU, they're the experts on constitutional rights. Mr. Rich should at least read 42 USC 1983. The JSO might want to take a peek at it as well. I have all the respect in the world for the Sheriff and for Undersheriff Mackesy, but I don't know if they grasp the danger to free speech implicated by the situation.

For those who need a reminder of the importance of anonymous public comments against powerful institutions should re-read Common Sense, by Thomas Paine.

[Diane Melendez]

I saw the entire thing UhDuh. If there was no criminal threat then this is an apparent clash between a preacher and one of his congregation. It had no business being investigated by the JSO or State Attorney's office. This is petty bull crap. Without a threat to person or property, then this is an apparent abuse of position and authority. Just for the record, helping an angry preacher get back at some one criticizing him is not what I pay taxes for and now how our resources should be used. This is a crock and it is the preacher, not those he is going after who is showing his true colors and they don't seem colors of forgiveness and love. This is a vendetta and a witch hunt. I guess he forgot to wear his WWJD bracelet.

[Uh Duh]

WWJD? OOH I know, I know, call on me Ms. Diane!!!!

TURN THE OTHER CHEEK!
They nailed him to a cross and he said, "Father forgive them for they know not what they do."

Oh I am sorry, I am just voicing one sinner's opinion.

[Diane Melendez]

You are funny UhDuh. I think this whole little drama will be a black eye on that mega organization. Boy, you do something this preacher doesn't like and he publicly calls you crazy. I do believe the whole thing shameful. Meanwhile, other members there should watch their backs, say the wrong thing to the wrong person and this preacher will go for your throat.

[blagg]

organized religion such as first baptist church is what gives great Christians a bad name.

Could they be more Christ-like instead of Christians"?

[Dog Walker]

Besides the blatant abuse of power that this represents, the other thing that jumped out at me was the reverend's $300,000 salary and a $350,000 gift of land plus wife being on the payroll. I know a bunch of bankers who would like that income.

And the reverend says that he is one of the LOWEST paid mega-church pastors in the Southtern Baptist Conference! Wow!

[Claude91098]

Originally Posted by Dog Walker

Besides the blatant abuse of power that this represents, the other thing that jumped out at me was the reverend's $300,000 salary and a $350,000 gift of land plus wife being on the payroll. I know a bunch of bankers who would like that income.

And the reverend says that he is one of the LOWEST paid mega-church pastors in the Southtern Baptist Conference! Wow!

If the pastor makes THAT much, then he is over the national average salary for ministers which was a few years back, $65K a year. Add his wife to the payroll and you can clearly see that his ministry seems more about the money than the mission and the Word. IMHO.

I, for one, have not lost faith in anything except "organized religion". THAT is one thing I have avoided for 30+ years now.

[Swamp Fox]

There is a fine line here between perceived threats to a large congregation and its pastor, (leading to some of the gunned down situations at churches recently) and freedom from big brother to speak your mind anonymously (since whistleblowers often go bankrupt before they get their cases heard). In this particular case, if you can believe what was written in the TU is the whole story (which experience tells me I cannot believe this is all of it), the sleuthing should have been done by private investigators on behalf of the church and by Det Hinson on behalf of the JSO with JSO not revealing to FBC what were the exact details of their findings. If JSO discovered what it felt were threats, then an arrest should have been made. If not, the info should have remained bottled up in the "Intelligence" unit. If FBC's investigators found out the info and the pastor took the actions reported by inviting the couple to a meeting (thereby exercising church discipline procedures), none of this would have been front page news.
When a church in Mandarin attempted to exercise discipline on a woman recently, she took the procedure to the news and made a spectacle of herself (that was her choice).
This appears to be a judgment issue within JSO and there are lots of those issues.